Let's take that left, you know, my way to take that MacBook air and just have a recycling for
Okay.
I like I say I'll keep it as I find more square parts you know I may bring it up to speed.
The memory though is not upgradable. It's soldered to the board. So what?
Okay.
So it's always gonna be a problem with it. That's why it's just not worth putting money into it.
Let's go.
Okay.
Yeah, before too long the Mac OS version. That you need to run a decent browser is not gonna work on something at all.
Does Safari have a Gary version that doesn't use memory?
He
This.
Hmm.
So. This is another Apple machine that you've got, Gary. That you're gonna be using.
Are you? Are you?
Yeah, it's a MacBook Pro instead of a Mac. And the Mac errors are basically physically lighter and thinner.
Of the Mac pro is or physically bigger and heavier, but they've also got expansion. Space in them and more connections more ports.
Have you started to transition moving, your password files and stuff over and things like that or?
I have not.
Do you use one password? On everything or what?
No.
Alright, if you say so.
Oh
Actually for the sake of the recording I'll say yes go ahead people try it Okay.
Okay. Alright.
Actually, let me let me for legal purposes say that no I did not give you all permission to try it.
That was a sarcastic comment and you are in no way legally enabled to pursue any password hacking attack.
Done it. And I just finished the 140. Videos on ethical hacking dug on it
Yeah.
But you know. Yeah.
Ethical hacking. It sounds like a contradiction in terms.
No.
Well, you could say it is, yeah.
Well, the There's a certification for it actually. And, IT pro TV.
Annual subscriber to they have an ethical hacking course and it's 100 I think a hundred and 148.
How, videos and, no, it's, 138 videos and works out to be 48 h worth of videos.
And I can remember at least 3 of them.
Yeah, 3 min.
What's gonna stay? If I'm more extent, I will be in my mind.
Yeah, about 3 min of them. There you go. It's very interesting course. I have no intention whatsoever to get the certification because just to test as long as a Almost a thousand dollars, I think.
Just to take the test. And, I wouldn't know what to do with it if I had it anyway.
I took training for.
SIR, you know, CH, version of 11 and I mean, I'm still that I just realized This is so far beyond me.
I don't want even touch it.
Okay.
Well, there's so much in there that. There is. It's very interesting and gives you a real appreciation of what what can be done.
Yeah.
And, a lot of, lot of things that It gives you a good.
A good basis on these is it. These are the 37 things I ought to be doing and II can do 12 of them if I really work at it and give up eating and sleeping, you know.
Okay.
Yeah.
Cause I can only do 5 of them without killing myself. I mean there's There's so many things that can be done.
And unfortunately not you know there's there's a number of things out there that you just If you're a target, you're gonna nail you because you haven't hit.
You haven't crossed all the Ts and dotted all the eyes. That's all there is to it.
Really? And, the, the firms that, do the, certifications are going and pen testing and all that kind of penetration testing.
You know, they must have 5, you know, 5 guys on staff to do that kind of stuff because nobody can do all that stuff in in a short length of time reasonably.
To deal with it.
Depends on how good a memory you have. Oops.
Well, that, well, I guess that in my youth I probably could have done that kind of stuff.
Because, but not anymore. I mean, comparatively. I still have a reasonably good memory.
I know I sarcastic say all the time I don't remember what I had for breakfast.
And there are there are minutes where I don't remember what I had for breakfast, but I mean.
Yeah.
Compared to some of my contemporaries. People I grew up with and went to high school with and You know, some of those guys are basket cases, I tell you.
And, and my health is not the best in the world, but it's way better than a lot of them.
And. Trying to do a lot more to keep it that way.
Oh well.
Kinda put in an unpaid plug. For another group.
Are you talking about, security? And ethical hacking. There is a group in St.
Louis called the 2,600 group. 2,600 for those of you who are familiar with it.
Is the name both of a magazine that you can go to a bookstore and buy. Comes out monthly.
It's all about hacking stuff and But there's a St. Louis chapter there has been for.
Oh, a couple of decades, not quite as old as our group. And they now meet, at arch reactor, which is close to downtown.
It's Jefferson and 40. But they also have On some months they have.
Put the meeting on to gypsy or zoom And so it kind of varies. You just have to check it out.
A lot of the talks they do are pretty good. I did not go to their monthly on the first Friday of the month.
And that is a national or international norm. All 2,600 groups are supposed to be meeting on on Friday night the first Friday of the month.
Okay.
And I have pointed out to them that this is a This is the reason why we are referred to as geeks.
Okay.
Our nerds, I should say, we're being referred to as nerds I should say we're being referred to as nerds because obviously if you're going to these meetings on Friday night, you don't have a social life.
Oh
Hmm.
But I occasionally do go to the meeting so it shows you where my social life is. But, but anyway, they, they sometimes have really good talks.
Sometimes it's or so. The one criticism I will say is their abstract. They almost never get out.
The description of the meeting until any earlier than the day before it's on meet up and we put we do try and put it on our calendar well and when they do put out a description.
They always try and make it cute. So it's like it's 4 times longer than it needs to be and you gotta read through all the QC stuff to figure out what it talks about.
So with that, I'm gonna try and put mine on the screen.
Let me see if I can do this.
Jonathan, was there a meeting you wanted? Plug. You're muted.
What was that, Stan? I didn't hear you. Didn't understand you.
What was there a meeting that you wanted to plug? I mean, We're Gary has just talked about the 2,600 club.
There was a meeting that you had said that was gonna be with,
They have and that dog is coming up at the
John Maydog Hall next Tuesday.
Yeah, we've got it on the calendar. I do believe and these
I have to write him a little reminder.
Yeah.
And then I have no more speakers lined up. Everybody is looking for work.
Yeah.
Hey, I think anybody should only be hired. Based on how good their talk was at a user group meeting.
There you go.
Yeah.
Hey guys, I gotta run to the library to pick up a book. I'll be back in 15 min.
Oh.
All righty, what a strange contract.
Hey.
Yeah.
I've read a hundred 50 books in the last 3 years.
Yeah.
I prefer the hard copy myself.
Always.
I like the I like the e-books
Yeah.
Yes.
I like to read weighty materials. A mine are all clay tablets sometimes.
I
Yeah.
We got shoes on so you haven't been around in the first stone world. Yeah, but do.
Hey, what I put up on the screen there is the meet up abstract from that last 2,600 meeting.
As I say, it's I've highlighted the park that actually says something reasonable. And so there's this much. That actually says something reasonable.
And so there's this much prof on the front with a title that means nothing to me Dolly's intro to the dark arts.
But when you finally get down to the last paragraph and a half. It basically says that they're gonna show how to cause buffer overflows so that you can go through the the output of buffer and see.
You know see what stuff might be revealed in a buffer overflow.
So it's basically a low level operating system hack. And, kinda, kind of goes together with, what Stephen Lumbar did for us 2 months ago.
2 or 3 months ago where he was talking about, buffer overflows. So, No, I did not.
Get into this meeting early enough last Friday. I tried to but I by the time I managed to tune in.
They were already done so And they don't, they almost never have recorded their meetings, which I think is unfortunate.
They're probably afraid of saying something they might get bling for. It's a hackers meeting, right?
It's like I was never there.
Yeah. Oh, I record stuff so I can ask my lawyer what it is I can deny.
That's right.
Okay.
Yeah. Okay, claim a permanent total. And insanity. Hmm.
Apparently a participant has enabled closed captioning, but I don't see it anywhere.
Well, if you go down to the bottom it says either show captions or high or hide captions.
Yeah, you gotta hit the show captions button.
Oh, there's a show captioned button where in it.
Yes, it's at the bottom.
On the on the bar in the bottom, are you running a browser? You running the app?
Hi, I'm on all kinds of things. Yeah.
I think you have to be in the app.
Okay, yeah, I'm in the app
Well, between the record button and the breakout sessions button is show caption.
Found it. Found it, found it. Okay.
Apparently that's not an offering in the browser.
Apparently.
Oh, when I started to say before we officially opened the QA, as far as, seeing things that were intended to be seen.
There was a court case that just wrapped up yesterday. Microsoft is trying to buy Activision, which is a manufacturer of computer games.
Oh my gosh.
Yeah, Sony tried to get the federal trade commission to block it for being monopolistic.
And the judge basically said, now we're not gonna block it and, end of case yesterday.
But one of the things that happened in the case. Was when they do discovery and they can ask the companies for you know documents.
And so they're asking Sony for certain business documents because Sony was the one complaining that this would be a a violation of Non-competes, monopolistic things.
Yeah.
Sony's lawyers used to Sharpie to Scratch out the rest of a document that would you know it didn't apply to, you know, what they wanted in the court to see.
Okay.
And so when you photo Photoshop or put a put this on you know a copy or it sees right through the ink of the Sharpie and you could clearly read the original Document.
Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh.
Oh
Nobody in the law firm got it, but the judge had a real good laugh publicly run at the board.
Oh my gosh.
Yeah, honestly, God, I've read some stories about how some companies just shoot themselves in the feet.
All right, that's pretty good. That's pretty common.
Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I mean, it's just simply. Some of the stupid things they do that just simply come back and bite them in the butt.
It just simply is shocking to me that You know, how the hell could they come up with these kind of maneuvers?
That's the thing.
You mean like Bud light?
Oh God, yeah.
Oh gosh, please don't start that.
That's gonna be that's gonna be a lesson. Forever in marketing school.
You know?
I'm unfamiliar with that. Can somebody give me a brief synopsis without going on and on and on.
Okay.
But light, made an agreement or a deal with a social media person Who is a, a transvestite?
She.
I was wondering if anybody knew the real word for that.
Yeah.
Yeah, so he, you know, he's, And the technical term is cisgender.
Yep.
His birth gender is he's a guy. And, but now he dresses up and puts on makeup and does his hair.
No you don't.
Oh, wow.
Yeah. Oh
So he looks like a woman. And, Well, okay. Anyway, but light, but light put her picture.
Oh
On a series of cans. Are they running cans with different pictures of different people that are in the news and stuff.
And so they ran a bunch of cans with her picture on it and in gratitude she went out on social media and made a nice little thing of her sitting there with all the cans, drinking beer and saying how grateful she was that Bud supported her and her, efforts of being a social media person and the crap it fan and there were actually other social
Whoo!
Oh yeah, well.
media post made of people taking the cans, putting them on fence posts made of people taking the cans, putting them on fence posts and using a shotgun to use yeah a lot of We actually.
Her, Whatever that person is,
That's not the only thing. Did you, they had the, oh God, it was. The marketing executive, the woman.
Yep.
Okay.
Number one, I wouldn't put her on TV because she was funny looking. But anyway, She got up and lectured everybody who bought Bud Light.
On, you know, everything that was wrong with them. Socially, intellectually. Got a yada yada and she just rant it and I'm going You dip shit, you don't talk like that about your c.
You can believe it. That's your right. But you know, if you're in marketing.
D. Isn't that one of the things they teach you in marketing is don't piss off your customers?
And short, she bought the farm.
Yep.
Oh, she got fired and her boss got fired. But you know what's funny is the last time anybody from Budweiser was on I saw in the news they were still trying to talk around it.
With management speak. Instead of just standing up because dudes, we screwed up. We apologize. We won't do it again.
Never yet.
If they would have done that, things would have been a lot better. But no, that just simply didn't happen.
Well, that's because in bed management. You know, if Bush was still managing it, in there, it never would have happened be if it did.
You would hunger in public or hung it in public.
Agreed.
I don't, I don't, well, I mean if the Bush family was still running it.
Yeah.
Elizabeth.
Yeah, it could be. I could be. You know they weren't they really weren't that stupid but You know, I mean the arrogance of this woman it was just Breakin, breathtaking.
Well, they almost immediately lost 15% of their market share. And I think it's been getting worse since then I haven't followed it but of a
It's down at least 30% by now.
Okay, but it they are no longer the number one selling brand. They've been to place.
Is it?
I like beer.
Have any beer?
A
I think of any beer. I think Bud White was the overall leader, at least in the United States and
Okay.
They, it was, I think it was worldwide the leader and it. Is it the other thing I've noticed is that all sorts of breweries are now advertising on that weren't advertising before like yingling.
You know, they're the oldest brewery in the country and but they never did much advertising that I ever saw and all of a sudden They're advertising.
All of a sudden the other breweries are advertising again. You know? Because you know Bud Light had apparently infinite money for advertising and they did a good job of it.
For many years and Now that they've committed suicide. Yeah, the other people are. Can't blame them.
Stepping in. Yeah, they're stepping up to the plate.
Yeah. You know, it's just holy macro.
I know the feeling.
I don't drink a lot of beer, but to recently I ran across one as a Mexican beer, Molito or something like that.
Pretty good, I thought.
Yeah, Modelo.
Modelo, that's it. Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah, I know. My
But I don't drink enough beer to buy a 6 pack so I just had one. A burnt to happen I'm wasted okay
What?
Hey, I drink now alcoholic beer for because I have to take certain medicine that doesn't allow me to have any alcohol.
Hey, I gotta go close my garage door. I'll be right back.
Already. Yeah.
Okay. Yeah!
Go ahead.
Alright, let's talk about Steve while he's gone. Yeah. Hey!
I'm listening!
Oh, never mind.
Oh
Yes. I was just sitting here all saying this humongous clash of thunder!
Oh
Oh gosh.
Anything back for you. I'm gonna drink a tea.
Oh.
Wow.
Okay. Okay.
Believe it or I found out there's a non alcoholic cause
Oh yeah. Yeah.
And I, and they're not available in St. Louis.
Really?
But I did find it online and I just suddenly looked and I thought, okay, fine. Doc and my head went on.
Okay.
In my use, you had you had to drive to Colorado to get the cooler's bear and drive and drive it back.
Yeah. Great.
They didn't sell it at us in Missouri. Yeah, and Did that a number of times as a matter of fact?
Oh my gosh.
Yeah.
Well, I had family living in Denver and, veil and couple other places in Colorado so go out here to visit and hey I want them out here I got a cooler Filler up?
Yeah.
My brother went to the University of Kansas at Lawrence. And then we're a number of times you'd bring back course home to St.
Louis.
Yeah. Yeah.
When they had it eventually here in St. Louis, I just went ahead. Exprosion bought a couple of 6 packs to my you know for myself that I could just simply have.
And my father was pitching about me drinking beer.
Oh, I'm Yeah. Well, I never drank a lot of beer, but I like.
Course and I like to call But other bears, I prefer room temperature of all things. A lot of them.
Okay.
And I really liked, when I was, I went to Germany for a month, one time and, like the tutor here.
Oh!
I think it was the name of it and it was about the size of a as a leader bottle, 2 liter bottle of And you see the workers, you know, they stop your lunch and that's what they'd have with their lunch.
Hi gosh.
And I started drinking that and I remembered it. I couldn't get off the bar stool.
Oh! Oh.
No, right there.
Okay, time to stop. But it was like I'd like to the beer at room temperature.
Plant under the monitor. Yeah.
Yeah. I had course for my birthday when I was still drinking.
Yeah.
And honestly, I liked it. I know it's a good birthday drink, but I'm still good.
I just can't have any alcohol anymore. Because the Mets I have to take.
The boards up there if you want.
Oh wow.
So.
My good little high for you.
Oh.
He made it.
Yay.
Everything else is crashing down.
Wow.
Okay. How about some technical questions? I got a technical question for you.
Shoot.
Please.
Go ahead, please.
Yeah.
Oh. Hang on, let me let me share your screen.
Okay.
Here it is. Okay. Firefox, this is 1 10. Although I've also tried 1 14 which is the current There is a that more and more.
1 one fifth. 1 15 is out.
Yeah, but the point is everything after 105.
Is not. Usable on some websites. And I was wondering if anybody has any idea on how to.
Trouble shoot it.
I don't have a clue.
I just don't have a clue. I'm sorry.
Okay. See, No, let me turn off you block.
No script. I've got Adobe. Oh, wait a minute. Maybe he needs Adobe.
But anyway, the, I've tried different,
Browser IDs. I actually got them set for Chrome.
Right.
Let's see.
Hey, do you have any error messages in the console?
Well that's the point. I haven't. Was it control? Control Shift-K.
I think it's control shipped I or F 12 I think but I could be wrong
Oh yeah, we can't see it. Yeah.
Well, I got it here. I guess you can't see it on the On the I get a source map error.
Oh boy.
Oh. Why are you not getting it on the screen? Well, it's not. Oh, hang on a second.
Can II wonder if I can share that.
There you go.
I mean, it's unlikely that we'll be able to debug some rent like a web websites code in the console, but maybe if you see some connection errors or something, maybe it can.
There you go. Install trigger is deprecated.
Oh Thank you. Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah, see that request access cookie storage was blocked. So it seems like you have something. That's blocking some cookie access that it wants maybe.
The model.
There's 6 of those errors. So. That could be. Doing it.
Looks like it's an angular application, so that doesn't really tell us a whole lot though, but.
Okay, well I've got all the JavaScript enabled except DEM Dex.
And Google Tag Manager.
Okay.
So, there's some like in the actual Firefox setting itself, there's, Strict mode or whatever, which I have turned on and probably you do too.
Okay.
But you might wanna try relaxing that to something. Less strict and try this website again maybe or.
No, I usually use standard because That's about the only thing that works with most of the websites I need.
Okay.
Oh, okay.
Exception. Okay. Okay, I would just hoping that there might be something in.
And I guess this is that one that said blocked with the cookies is, probably that's my guess for why it's happening, but it is just a guess.
So.
I think it's a pretty good guess. Okay, loading failed for the script.
Yeah.
What was there about quarks up about 2 lines?
Yeah, I guess I gotta use that scroll. Pages and quirks.
Hey, may be impacted for standards modes. Use doc type HTML.
I don't have any control over that.
Okay.
Loading failed for Adobe.
What are you looking at Lee?
This is the, console. Firefox console that shows you errors.
When you try and load a website. This is an example of a website that This is one of the earliest ones that failed.
And it stopped working in Firefox, anything newer than like 105.
Huh.
So I've got 5 or 6 more here in the last 6 months. And my main bank site quit working.
A couple of weeks ago.
Oh.
Done.
Yeah.
I got it. Oh.
Yeah, I have for my bank. I have to go to Chrome. Okay.
Although I did find on Google Chromium. Which works and at least you know there's no Google hooks in there.
What's that browser called?
UN-Googled Chromium.
Huh.
And that exists because Google, since they open source to somebody, can just go in and. Right.
Well, that's what brave is too. They just for getting
But, Brave has so much other crap. I can't stand it.
Which cramp?
Points.
A Bitcoin wallet or not not a big not even Bitcoin it's like some crap coin.
Some scam coin.
Who knows? I ignore that stuff.
Oh well, I was just.
Maybe I'll just. Copy this, you know, go to the bank site and then copy the console and send it to him.
Hmm.
Hi guys, thanks.
I posted something in the chat oracle. So I talked last time about how. Red hat kind of made their source code only available to subscribers and they put up a, that says basically sharing the source code.
With non-subscribers is basically gonna violate the terms of their So, Oracle since then have released a, a statement trying to be the good guys here trying to sound like the good guys and like hey all you people that are a fleeing from real because of this change come over here because we
you know we respect open source and we've always been in like no no you haven't. I don't know who's falling for that.
It happens.
If it's a manager talking, don't believe him.
Yeah.
An excellent observation. Oh, okay. I think, since we're now about 7 min after 7, this is a little later that I was planning on doing this but as far as announcements.
Let's see, an announcement that, I have is, we're always looking for.
Excuse me.
Little more help so anybody out there who would like to help contribute and Tyler you've already volunteered and I know I've been meeting to get back with you on that.
Thank you.
We'll get to organized with you soon. But you know just little things doesn't mean you had to come to more meetings or if you want to or you can help do publicity
Oh
You can provide music for the meetings. That's a very important thing. But, but yeah, Obviously this week, we kind of came up short on, getting, speakers arranged in advance.
And a big thank you to Steve Stegman who very, very last minute. Was available to step in and do the present station tonight so thank you Steve But if other people have suggestions for topics for talks.
Our speakers for talks or would like to speak themselves of any of those would be. Certainly welcome so and, let's see.
Go ahead.
We have we have all we have all kinds of suggestions We just got no volunteers to do what's been suggested.
We have a thing called a planning schedule report. That's available. You go to WWE sloop.
Dot org slash planning. Got PDF pull that up.
Further on down we got like 180 suggestions.
You know, any one of those. Practically anybody that shows up at our meeting could do something of a very, that would be interesting.
It doesn't have to be. Nailed down and super professional the idea is to get somebody talking about something that they've tried to work with.
Good evening.
And it's really good to say. This is a path I went down and these are the problems I had and II mean, you know, this is how I solved it or this is how I did to solve it and You know, those are better the better kind of meetings because when you somebody has a problem and you and you
tell them how you You solved it. You learn more from that. Then you do from just a slide that goes or a presentation goes from step 8 to step.
Z and with no hiccups in them in the middle. Cause if you try to reposition any of that, you're gonna wind up with your own hiccups.
And as always a good idea or it's always beneficial to see how somebody solves a problem. You may not run into that exact same problem.
But just seeing that kind of thing would give you an idea if it adds to your experience level to seeing other people solve things.
Okay.
Oh, I always say.
You don't have to do you know 50 or 60 slides like I do but if you do 10 slides with with material on it.
It helps the your audience stay focused on what you're talking about. It helps you keep focused on what you're gonna talk about.
It could be very simple. You don't need even do slides. You can just.
Bring up a terminal and do a demonstration or something and start talking about that. That kind of stuff is great.
It really is. And, I get carried away, but nobody else has to be carried away like I am.
I mean, they're gonna wrap me up some day with a with a jacket with real long sleeves wrapped around the back.
Take me out to back.
Okay.
Thank you, Stan.
Okay.
Any, Stan, any other, topics or putting an announce?
What do you mean?
Is anything else that should be announced? Well, you're thinking of that leave any then you need one else.
Oh, thank you to Dave Forrest for his $200 donation, which I deposited.
Oh, that's nice.
To do. Yeah.
Okay. Big hand today. Appreciate it. Thank you.
Thank you.
Now we've got to figure out how to spend it.
No.
We know how we're going to spend it is just
Yeah, it will cover significant amounts of overhead.
Yeah.
Okay.
Oh, I would.
For all of our other dates coming up. Oh, as on the calendar or anything changed.
I would like to mention earlier in in the day this morning when I went to post the the link to what we got going on, the instructions.
A trouch.
Good old Google change something. That many calendar we had. Broke and it took me More than a half hour to figure out how to fix it or well had to figure out that it wasn't me that broke it.
It was. You had to go back and compare it to previous editions. And I said, well, I didn't change anything.
Yeah.
So. Then it just took a little bit longer to fix it. So that's working again. So it's this stuff.
Changes sound not as bad as meetup.com meetup. Dot com. It's just it's terrible about that stuff.
Yeah. Yes.
Those change, those changes stuff the way we edit something and it looks horrible.
Whatever.
Okay. That we didn't have to pay for.
Alright. Unless there's any other things, I, well, I do have things kind of an announcement and a backwards announcement.
So, early last month was the national geospace conference it was held here in Saint Louis.
Anybody else get down to that?
Did you? I did. Oh.
Nobody else. It was it seemed to be a good conference. I mean it I don't know how many people they expect it, but they did seem to fill up a a nice section of the convention center downtown.
And Oh, is a lot of out of town people. Obviously a lot of the geospatial people of interest located in, Virginia and Maryland area.
Where a lot of government agencies are, other developers or around the country, you know, different.
Companies but so a number of years ago this conference started in the Washington DC area, a greater DC area.
And, they finally decided that with the, NGA here in St. Louis, the, they decided they have every 4 or 5 years 3 or 4 years was their plan would get it to St.
Louis and of course we got put off because of the COVID outbreak so it hasn't been here for 5 or 6 years but Yeah, seemed like a good conference.
I didn't get to be there all the time, but, Yeah, had some interesting stuff.
So look forward to it in future years.
With that, our speaker tonight is now primed his hair correctly and is no longer got, horns or,
Oh
No, I had to go outside and I got rain on. Okay.
Yeah, well.
Oh, Oh dear. So, but as I said, we really appreciate, Steve putting this together very, very much at the last minute when I told him, okay, our original speaker hasn't been able to do this.
Our original speaker hasn't, been able to do this. So, so Steve is up for tonight and we're up to hear all about, T mux and all the other commands besides those first 2 we learned.
Steve, take it.
Alright, hang on.
I gotta find my
Oh gee, where did I put that?
Oh.
Okay.
There it is. Good God. See if I can share my screen if I can get that to work.
Yay, working.
Okay.
Oh, invitation even. Check this out. Yeah, oh yeah.
Look at that. Pretty impressive, huh?
Yes.
Yeah.
Well, I made a presentation very similar to this a few years ago. So that made it easier. Yeah, I had to learn.
Library office in press. Which that works okay.
No, it just it helps to know how to use it. Which I didn't.
Anyway, T mux. It's a terminal emulator for running bash or I guess any command shell of your choice.
It's typically used on servers that have no graphics. You can put it on a server that has graphics, but you know, why would you bother?
The best part about it is
The main features that you can detach from a session. You can log off gracefully. And your session will be waiting for you when you log back in.
I'm sure Lee does this 25 times a day. And when you exit, oh my spelling, gee, well, But you know, power failure, communications failure, whatever.
You don't need to make a graceful exit. As long as the server keeps running when you log back in it'll be waiting for you.
As long as the server keeps running.
Some terms you need to be a need to be familiar with. The top level is a session.
And every session contains at least one window and one pane.
Second thing you need to know is what's a window.
It's a rectangle with with in which there is stuff. Okay, and every window contains at least one pain.
The pain is the lower level. The pain is actually contain your shell. And will display your, you know, whatever you got going.
Let's see. Here's what it looks like. You see down here in a lower left hand corner.
That's, that's the session name. It's in, square brackets.
Then there's 3 windows.
And you can switch back and forth from them.
The pain is named Euler. It happens to be the computer it's running on. And then of course it's got time and date down at the lower right hand corner.
And the, when you want to refer to these sessions or windows. You can use either the String name or you can just use 0 one or 2.
And we're looking right now at number 2. You can tell that because there is a an asterisk here.
Let's see what an next one is. All right, now here's one. Very similar, but it's got 2 pains.
And when you hit. The attention key which is control B for T. You probably could change it to something else, but.
Why would you bother? Hit control B. And hit a queue, it will then identify which pain is your wish and that of course that's pain 0 and that's pain one.
You it says PII think you're screwed.
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
So anyway. You.
So that was that was 3 screens, 0 one and 2, correct? 3D. Perfect.
Okay, okay I wonder.
Yeah, well this one's only got 2 pains so the first one is number 0 and the second one is number one the That's pains.
Correct.
Okay, so it's 3 pains
Pains exist within Windows. The windows are listed down here. I've got a live one in, you know, I can show you how this works on the live one in a minute.
Okay, cool.
This will be a real pain.
Oh, I'm sure we can.
Yoo!
Everybody's got to come up with one now.
Ha ha.
So anyway, when you enter a command in T mux, You enter the command right here in the.
Pain. This is a single pane here. Okay, and what you do is you first you give it the attention key, which is control B.
And that tells it that the next.
Thing it sees is gonna be your command. So to switch from one window to the next, you would hit Control B.
And then hit N for next.
And, If you type T mux, it will start a session. If you type T mux again, it will start another session.
You can have as many sessions as you want. I haven't really experimented with. You know, doing this recursively.
Although I'm sure you could get your computer screwed up if you worked at it. Control B followed by a D.
Detaches from the current session.
Let me move this over. Wait a minute, come back here.
Okay, that's a live T-mux window. If I hit Control B and a D.
It's gone. Well, it's not really gone, but you know.
Let's see.
What do you mean by not really gone? I mean, it's the session.
It's still there.
Okay.
He just attached from it. Okay. Alright.
Unless you Unless you you just detached. You know, like if you If your computer loses power.
This session will still be there. You just have to log in again once you get everything running. As long as you don't lose the server that the T mux is running on.
I'm pretty sure it doesn't recover from that.
Okay.
Correct me if I'm wrong, Lee.
No, it doesn't. But you can connect to that session on a server. From any machine at any time.
In other words, you don't have to connect to it with the one you created it on.
Right. And you get down here to, sharing a session. Basically if you have this another person to log in to the same server that you're running on and use the same username.
Then they can attach to the same session and now you'll both be seeing the same thing. Like this.
So these 2 are both looking at the same, session. So, Fred. Windows 0.
And if you run something in this one.
Cool.
Shows up in both. And all these dots around here, all that means is One screen is smaller than the other and Your active area is only as big as your smaller screen.
Excuse me, I got hiccups.
Yeah. I really got hiccups tonight doing well.
Let's go back up here.
Yeah, now your session commands, TMX of course starts a new one. The attention of D.
Detaches and you can hang up. Go away, come back. I've got a little raspberry here that I use for.
Recording time so I can tell when my power failed and It also records the temperature in the office here every, I don't know, 5, 10 min.
And I normally only attached to it. A couple times a month.
They just get in there and say TA and it attaches and. Detach and it just sits there happily.
The if you've got a name session
We're thunder. They use this. Where X is the name of the session. Oh, that session is Fred.
You could say Fred. Teamux LS, what that'll do is that will Show you.
Oh, that computer doesn't have that command on it. Never mind. Let's get this computer because it does have that command on it.
Hmm.
Oh, I know where it is.
Okay.
There you go. Hi, SSH over to a computer. Didn't have some of the commands on it.
Use your answer.
So you say T. It'll show you how many sessions are out there.
Over 2 h.
Fred's the one that both of these windows are looking at and there's also a Number one.
Question.
The end of the last screen.
Shoot.
When you do the install of T mux, is it add all these commands or are there separate things that you have to?
Have to
Last week. To. Morning.
Well, that's what I'm gonna I'm gonna show you that any command that starts with T mux and then there's some other behind it.
Right.
Those are default demands that come with T mux. You don't have to do anything.
Okay.
He
I've created a bunch of, little shell scripts. So if I say just say TL.
They get away. Take it.
That's gonna run one of my shell scripts which basically does T mux Ls.
I've got a number of the other ones. I'll give you a copy. I'll go through them here and.
You know, happy to give them to you. Gary, if you are running on Apple, you will have to rewrite these functions for whatever Apple does.
Oh, he can use the Apple to talk to a real computer.
Hey, there you go.
That's true. That's true.
Hey, you, you can open a terminal window on Mac OS. It's just a BSD seashell.
Yep. If you want to kill a session that's T mux kills session. And you wanna rename it.
Good. The attention key. Dollar sign. And the new name for this session.
Okay.
Let's see. Now within Windows exist within a session. Attention N switches to the next one attention C creates a new one.
Attention W lists the windows and attention ampersand kills the current window. Now this C here, there is a another version of that command.
So you can create a name to window if you want. I typically don't. You know, I'm not, I'm not gonna have enough windows open and I need names on them.
1, 2, and 3 is good enough for what I do.
You might wanna add exit to your list under, kills the current window.
Control B exit.
Oh, oh, oh.
Yeah. If no. Yeah, I've got E is an alias for exit. So E is quicker than gonna call me in.
Right.
Yeah, if you if you bring up a window. And just type exit. It'll drop it out.
Boom.
Okay.
There's still one there.
Okay.
Pains exist within a window.
And you can. I use this because it has every thought.
If you want.
Control B double quote. Splits it horizontally. Control B percent splits it vertically.
Oh, Steve. One quick comment here. You you can remap. These any keys you want like in horizontal I use the dash.
Yeah.
Vertically use the pipe symbol it's a heck a lot easier remember
Sure. Yeah, these are just a default. Came happings I haven't really messed with I don't use it enough Lee if I used it as much as you did I'd have that all remapped but You know, II just don't do it.
Yeah, but it's been 10 years since I did the. I don't remember what's in there.
Yeah
What's up with all these dots? Why is it only taking up like a fraction of your terminal here?
Well, what that means is
You see I've got 2 terminals here. They're both looking at the same session. And the smaller one.
This is the this is the size of a smaller one. You'll notice down here. It says from a smaller client.
94 columns by 30 lines comes from a smaller client. And if you look over at the other one, it doesn't say that.
I'm sorry, where is it?
So what that's telling you I'm sorry?
Where is it saying that? All the way down to bottom right.
Right down here, right down here in the bottom right.
And I'm there. Okay, thank you. Thank you.
But it, you know, if you If you, you know, if you're sharing a screen and you know, you don't have the screen exactly the same size.
You know, it'll See like if I make this one bigger, do you notice how that happened?
Yeah.
No, I didn't. He made the blue one taller. And that window lost dots on the bottom because it's now.
The one on the left. Is taller.
It's taller. It's got more lines. This one on the right, got more columns.
Gotcha.
And you can split these screens at infinitum. You know. I'm not sure what how much utility it has, but you know you can do it.
Let's see.
Yeah, I've, whenever I'm debugging a Naga O's command, I've got 3 screens.
The definition. The call out and the Thank you.
Yeah. Oh yeah.
Years ago you before we got all our term all of everybody had goofy Back any olden days.
We used to use Emax for this. It'll do exactly this stuff.
You can split the windows up any which way you like and then run a command shell in each one of them.
Works. Fine.
Honey, get rid of them with control BX. Oh, and then it asked you down here.
Do you really mean that?
Which with my memory is probably a good thing.
Hey, can you go back there and Split it up again with the 3 pains. Or the pain.
Sure.
Okay. Oh.
You
Wait a minute. Or how to command. Which one does that?
Hmm.
Can you still see the screen?
Yeah
Yeah. Oh. Lost presentation. Got the screen and at the presentation.
Yeah, what happened?
Don't know.
Mike, there you go.
One. There you go.
Oh, neither. Oh. It jumped over.
So anyway.
Now we have the presentation, but no, no, show windows.
Yeah. Let's see, we take this one and
This screens here if you bang them up against the edge of the screen, they jump to the next workspace.
Which I find irritating. I turn it off if I could, but you know, I'm too lazy to go looking for it.
Why would they jump? Is, is that something weird about? Is that a Buntu?
That's this particular window manager in a.
Okay, so that, that's a function of the window manager because Good home. You can split it.
Yeah.
You can split the same. Window across 3, how many screens you got. Can I just extend it across multiple screens?
Mean like this.
Okay.
Yeah.
Okay, I'll see. Where were we anyway? Okay.
I wanted you to do the T mux window with the 3 pains in it.
Does that a quick I had a question about that
Okay. Okay, there's one with 3 pains in it.
Okay, I see the cursor there to bottom. How do you get up? Up to the top?
Right?
Do you just move your mouse or do you do is there come in?
No. No, it's, it's, this is a genuine old style and there is nothing.
Yeah.
It doesn't it doesn't really know the mouse is there. So if you do control BO it switches You notice how the cursor is jumping?
Yeah.
Okay. That's what I wanted to know. Yes. How is it?
Or you can define a macro with control B and an arrow key.
Okay.
Oh yeah.
Oh.
Oh, there it says right on your slide, switches to the next pane. Okay.
A control B with a queue does this. We gotta watch. It doesn't stay up there very long.
Yeah.
But it shows you which pain is which.
What?
Cause, tight.
Excuse me, I was coughing.
Hope it didn't hurt too much.
Okay.
No.
Okay, now one of the things is scrolling mode.
This thing.
Let me get rid of this here.
Okay, if you just hit the arrow keys.
What it's doing is it's just working on that command line. Going back through the history.
No, if you controlled. If you can, if you control B first.
Yeah
And an arrow key on my account file it'll switch to a window or a pain in that direction of the
Yeah, well the default is control B and hit page up And you see that little. Thing light up over here.
Yeah.
It's telling you that it's 0 lines from the bottom.
Okay.
And then you can go up or down with the standard arrow keys. Left, right, back and forth.
You can also use the Emax arrow keys. They're programmed in there.
It's not changing.
The little lit up box wasn't changing.
Yeah, I see that.
No.
Yeah, I don't I don't know it was working
Oh well.
And now it's gone.
Yeah Well, I'm out of scroll.
You only got one pain. Oh, got one pane.
Oh, yeah.
No, scrolling mode. Oh, control B. Okay, there it goes. Now.
It's not working. It was working earlier. Any ideas, Lee?
What are you trying to do? Why?
See that little yellow box in the upper right hand corner?
Oh,
It will show it.
The line.
0 0. Good question. I don't remember ever using it.
Well, what?
The line at the bottom show The line at the bottom shows you only have one pain open in the window.
Yeah. Yeah.
And that's what's being displayed on the screen is just one pane. So.
Yeah, I know, but this this thing in the upper right hand corner. What that would normally do is that would show you how many lines from the bottom of the window you are.
I think I'm not I'm not an expert, but I think this is something called like, copy mode or something.
And so I think you're supposed to navigate around your terminal and then you can copy things and do your clipboard.
Using this mode, I think.
Yeah, you could.
You certainly could.
Let's see, go over here. Okay, well these 2 are that shows you what have the 2 screens I've got shows you what happens if you have another person login to the.
Log into the, machine with the same username.
We and I do that all the time.
Well, we used to one hours work and now all I do is drive my wife back and forth to the doctor in the hospital.
Sure.
What was he trying to demonstrate?
So anyway. Now I've written some T mux functions. And you're more than happy to have a copy of it.
I was trying to figure out why it was 0 0 was changing.
Anyway, so the Yeah.
I'm a 16, Steve. I didn't understand. What was the point you were saying about You were logged in as the same username.
Well, if you log into the same server.
Using the same username.
Is the
And do, and username. You can have 2 different at the same screen.
Then you can then you can run 2 2 copies of T mux one from well for my house and Leeds we do that all the time.
Yeah. And we'll be looking at the same screen.
Okay.
That's all it is really if you You can have, I don't know how many terminals logged into a given username on a given machine.
In which they can all. The attached to one TMX session. That's what you got here.
Okay.
If you look in the lower left hand corner, you'll see both of these screens. Or a attached to TMX session one.
Okay.
So that's all that is. Gary.
Alright, okay.
Yeah.
And this means this screen is narrower than this one. News means this screen is shorter than this.
Okay.
Yeah, and if one of them is real small See what happened to the other one.
Oh yeah.
Trunk down.
Hey, that's handy. You know.
Then let's look at some of these functions here. Let's get this back over here.
Okay.
So these are just vast shell scripts. Nothing else.
So TA is a function that attaches to an existing TMX session.
You just say, TA space.
You know, 1, 2, 3, whatever session you want to walk to. Tl lists.
The the sessions.
Yeah, now there's only one I killed one of them.
This one, TCS, that creates.
I could type it would help.
Oh, okay. I should be doing that from another window.
Yeah, I was wondering what would happen there.
Let's get another window up here. Okay, now.
I do a TL and I you see I've got
2 sessions instead of one. I was down to one there for a while. And if I just type exit.
But these guys still have that session and session. Oh, no, I kill that session. Never mind.
I don't think that was supposed to do that.
Oh.
The one TRS that renames the session.
TK kills a session.
TN renames a window.
TNP renames a pain
And I don't remember where this gobly goat came from, but you know this this file is several years old, so I don't remember that detail.
Okay.
Read names to pain. I thought Pane just had numbers.
They can have names.
That's probably control B.
And then.
Backslash or control B space and 0 3 3 probably octal 33
Yeah
And then here's another one. This actually is useful.
TSS H Oh, gotta give it a name of a machine.
So it brings up a session on Tesla. You notice that it changed this name down here. Change the name of the window.
The Tesla, which is the other one it's looking at. But. I'll be happy if anybody's interested, I'd be happy to mail you a copy of this file.
. You're more than welcome to them
But that's about the end of my slides. I didn't make 50 slides.
Your function are displayed in the recording so anybody can. Watch the recording and pause it and etc.
Yeah.
And then. Give me your email if you want and then you can. They can ask for a copy.
I mean.
Alright.
Let's see here.
I'll put my email in this window.
There it is.
That works.
Okay.
Now he's gonna wonder why all of his email winds up on a T muck section on some of the machine that.
Somewhere there's somebody running T mux that's gonna get a lot of spam
Yeah.
-Oh.
Go ahead. Oh God, I delete at least a hundred every day. And that's F.
Filtered out the ones I'm actually interested in.
But that's about all I got to say about T mux. I leave anything out Lee.
Yeah, I did a good job, Steve.
Very nice, Steve. Thank you.
You're welcome.
Any idea what was? A year of when T mux first. Appeared in the world.
Oh, I have no idea.
I'm pretty sure it's been around for quite some time, I think.
Yeah, well I remember when I was working over at Mac. Back in the late eighties. I was first there as a contractor.
And. They used to do the exact same thing I'm we're doing here with T mux, I used used to use emacs
You know there was no gooey version of Emacs in those days at least I never didn't know anything about it
Okay.
I don't really think there was back in 88 89.
And.
So I mean you can split the screen and put a command prompt in each screen. Log into a different machine.
You can do all of that.
You know, you get You can do all that with with Emacs. It'll do all of it.
Yeah.
But I don't have another hour.
Okay.
That's good.
No, but you got you got the first one that's all that's all accounts. Works static.
We're educated. Hey, you're muffin.
Maybe in, they get back into using Team. I think only ever use just very few commands, but, seen a demo- like that gives me an idea.
That I will probably wanna start using it.
If anybody wants it, here's, Oh. That I use is simple stuff.
Here is a chute.
Oh, wasn't the original, wasn't the original team box wasn't it screen?
Yes, it was called screen.
It is. Well, screen and team m are 2 different programs. Screen was has been around for a long time.
Team Mux is a is a new tool. I have no idea how old it is, but
Yeah, but they're both, they're both screen multiplexers.
Correct. Correct. All right.
Yeah, well the advantage is the one advantage of screen is it usually comes since pre-installed.
Yeah, it's usually on the, you know, distribution CD or DVD.
Yeah, but if you're going to want to use it for any admin work you want T-MOX not screen.
T mux is a lot more capable, a lot more mature.
One of the things.
Randy posted up and discussed saying that, the initial release of T mux was 2 00 7
Do more about screen. Well, he doesn't bench on the release of screen is.
I'm thinking that maybe. Steve the stuff you're thinking you're doing it at Mac back in the 19 eighties.
Play a bet on screen and not.
BT 100 terminal I mean like, okay.
Green will connect to a serial port.
Yeah.
Is there anything down here?
It could be a copy right at the end. Thank you.
Not that too. Oh Berkeley. It is from BSD days.
That's got it in October, 2017. That's the that would be the fourth one I guess.
Okay.
That's the man page updates. Force addition.
Yeah, I guess we don't know.
Anyways, you know, screen is a lot older than team ups.
So we listen on Wikipedia.
I go back and find a lot of stuff on Wikipedia. Let's say screen software or.
Screen Linux software or something like that. To narrow it down. Otherwise you'll wind up looking at screenplays.
Yeah. Yeah, natural, release of screen was 1987.
Okay.
Thanks, Bill.
And that's why they want the guy that did. He took on a tea strokes from Screen, but he used Control B because screen use control A.
Oh, good.
But a lot of people like to. Reduce Tmax, they have control A that way they don't they got the same command structure.
That they have to use both of them.
Yeah, you can change it, but Control A can be a problem if you're on BSD.
Is control A is home. Under,
Okay.
One of the commands of the team actually might be worth mentioning is that to show all the commands that control B and then question mark.
That will list all your commands.
There you go.
That doesn't show what you. Remap though.
So this doesn't change if you remap something.
Steve mentioned it, but it bears repeating. If you've got a bunch of pains open or a bunch of windows open rather.
Control B and then the index is a quick way to jump from like one to 7 or something like that.
I like to use the control VL. Or last. A way you you work on one pain or window then you can control B and then L.
Oh!
To go back to the other one, you kind of travel back and forth between them.
Oh nice. Select a previous current window. Cool.
Hey, it didn't show the clock. Control VT.
Control B time. Okay, we gotta do it.
Yeah.
Where do you? Modify the status line. I know there's somewhere that you can modify the status line.
In your T.
Shet minus G status left. I put on the left.
And I have no recollection of what this does, but.
Number of screens, number or something. What kind of options do you have to modify the command line?
The status one.
Like where do you find that what you can put in there?
And that would be set minus G.
That option minus G.
I am not sure.
A bunch of examples in on-the-man page.
No, that's kind of interesting. You've actually changed the background of the status line to remind you where you're running.
So that allows you to color. Color the different pains is it?
Right, no, the caller the different status. Color the host.
Stanus change the background of the status line.
Oh the status line, okay.
Right.
Well, that'd be handy. Yeah, cool.
Oh yeah. Well I think I was my experience had been with using screen and I was found it quite limiting.
Yeah, it is.
Compared to this. Yeah, team up.
Yeah.
You know, for example, on a server. Back in Iraq. GX is an alias I have.
For too much attached.
Oh, by the way, you can define those as aliases as well as functions. I've never actually used functions.
You know, but here I have 1, 2, 3, 4 windows.
Next window next next window. The point I was making is when you're managing 40 or 50 hosts.
Out in the wild. I make damn sure I've got the host name in in the.
Pro. Good boy. Very good point. I have no clue where I am at any 1 point in time.
Okay.
That that function that I had TSSH. That sets the host name into the status line.
Good point, Steve.
Yeah, I hear. I went through 3 different house. For 3 different servers.
And each one of them has a Ti use it just to keep a root session handy. So I can log in to a tango x-ray.
And I've got a you know I've got root privilege. Pick 2 characters. II can.
Perform that function in 2 characters.
There's a different one.
Nice. What else?
Yeah, the machine out in the wild, notice that. A lot of client machines. I ended up calling the main server.
So I change your host name.
On the machine to put the client in front of me.
Yeah, anything so you can remember where you are
Yeah, no kidding.
Cause I've got probably 9 or 10 main servers out there in the wild. And many years ago.
I was on main server and I thought I was on a different one.
Wasn't good.
Yes.
Yeah, what else?
It says my internet connection is unstable. I wonder what that means.
I don't know, sucking up too much.
Was that message to me?
Thank you.
I haven't seen it on the machines here.
Okay.
If you're getting a pretty bad rainstorm out there, maybe, are you on fiber are you on, Wireless, that could be a problem.
Oh.
Oh yeah.
Now my most of us passed past him.
What you say, Lee?
Yeah, now. I said most of the weather has gone past you.
It's, way, way southeast of Saint Louis down close to Red Budman.
I'm just watching them weather the radar.
Yeah, it was nasty stuff going by you there an hour ago.
Yeah, in fact, if you look. So southwest of St. Louis. Union is getting plastered and there is more coming.
This is true.
Oh no, I'm sorry. It's going. Northwest.
No, it's going, southeast.
Yeah.
Yeah, it's dissipating. Well, once you went by Steve out there, it lost all its strength.
You sucked it up, Steve. Steve, you gotta go easier on that weather man there.
Yeah, breaking up now.
Okay. In. Yeah.
Actually, that blob is still in Missouri. It looks pretty. Yeah, it is. And now it's
Stop this thing at 80'clock.
To report on
Okay, a question to the group. We have any more. Good technical questions. You think coming up or should we consider?
Turning the recordings off. We can stay open for a bit longer, but. Should we wrap up the official recorded session?
Wrap it.
Alrighty, this was the, St. Louis Unix user group. General Meeting for the Month of July.
The date is Wednesday, July the twelfth, 2023. Our speaker tonight was Steve Stegman.
Who was talking to us about the fancier extra commands you can put into or options you can put into the TMX command.
So